Detailed minutes from the meeting with Jim Grieve

These are the detailed minutes from the meeting with Jim Grieve (they are a bit rough and ready, sorry): Please, if you think I've missed anything, or made any errors, let me know.

Marilyne said that city development has promised a review of boundaries in about 12 months - once things have settled. Changes would take a number of months (9?) after that - if there are no objections it might be quicker. A two part consultation is needed and the legal processes can't really be rushed.

New zones have a 2 permit limit. That isn't the case in the old zones. The council is considering applying that limit to the old zones. Second permits would become more expensive. They are also considering making permits cheaper for environmentally friendly cars (SUVs would still be the same price).

The council have discussed so far an extension of the controlled parking times until perhaps 8 in the evening - giving residents more time
Comment from me: probably, most of the people without permits parking at this time are most likely residents who've not yet bought permits. Wouldn't they just buy them if this came in? Then we'd have exactly the same situation except that council revenues would increase (I'm not cynically suggesting that is the motive).

A question was asked about the reason for introducing dual use in S1. Jim answered that they had noticed that the demand is fluid, changing at different times of day and that dual use is a response to this. The proper name for dual use is shared use.

The council is in discussions at the moment to determine whether the shared use changes should be introduced in a piece meal way or city wide.

The council is concerned about sustainability of solutions. Therefore, some 'focused' short term solutions would be possible before the review which will come in 12 months.

Redrawing zone boundaries is considered the most sustainable way to do things.

There was a suggestion (from Jim) to allow residents to begin parking in pay & display from 4pm onwards. The idea of applying this in the morning, to allow residents to stay in the bays longer than the 9am cutoff was raised and Jim thought there may be some scope there as well. Some residents felt that this might be more complicated than necessary and suggested we go directly to dual use.
Comment from me: At the time I don't think it was clear if we were talking about long term or short term solutions. I think we may have objected to this, thinking it would be for the long term. It certainly would help in the short term and I think we should try to get it put back on the table as well as the permission to use S1.

Jim had concerns that merging 7, 8 and S1 would make a 'super-zone', too big. He believes that this goes against the whole idea of controlled zones and risks inter-zone commuting.

The council will be doing parking surveys. These will begin on Monday. They will take 2 weeks. Analysis of the results is expected to take 1 week. The area to be covered by the survey is South Clerk Street and up to Bruntsfield Links. These 'Beat Surveys' will be taken at five points during the day. There will then be a report to the executive.
Comment from me:We need to get a copy of that report and the data

Shared use cannot be done quicker than the legal processes allow. Changes could not even begin before the traders' permits are ready - this means that it will be at least 5 months before consideration will begin. Analysis can happen, but the council can't be asked for approval before then - then the consultations need to begin.

Changing so that residents can park in pay and display from 4pm wouldn't require a traffic regulation order - changing to shared use would. Jim would need to check out the potential limitations of this. But, he felt that it would confine the effect to the areas affected and would be appropriate. He wasn't prepared to make promises, yet.

In Greenhill, people have been able to park in neighbouring zones. To repeat this it needs to be 'focused'. We will give Jim a list of streets and evidence that these streets are hurting. The council will then send letters to all permit holders in those streets allowing them to park in S1. Parking wardens will be given the registrations of these cars and will not ticket them if they are parked in residents' bay in S1. There would be no cost to residents for this. Jim wanted to be clear that this would be temporary only, up until such a time as the long term solutions were in place and it wouldn't bind the council to anything.
Jim resisted the non-focused approach. Changing by geography, rather than by named streets, would have a different political feel.
Approval only needs asking the council heads - this is because this approach has already happened in other areas (Zone 6) and doesn't need a legal process.

We will need to supply locations of potential changes to the yellow lines - turning these into parking - additionally, we'll need to suggest areas for the bolder changes.

There is the possibility that in the long term, rather than S1 adsorbing the 'panhandles' of 7 and 8; 7 and 8 may instead adsorb some parts of S1.


The council has no proposals to introduce free parking bays near traders. There are a few half hour bays elsewhere in the city. The council believes they are producing opportunities for customers to park. At present anyone can park for 10 minutes. You have 5 minutes allowed and then you have 5 minutes grace.

One of the ideas behind the CPZ was to benefit the traders, allowing customers to find parking spaces.

There will be a consultation exercise regarding shopping areas in some parts of Marchmont and Sciennes. Then, afterwards, there will be a public consultation period. They will be looking at four shopping areas in the city where they feel that some enhancement would assist the local businesses. Argyle Place and Terrace would be one of the areas under review. They would review street furniture, parking, accessibility. The Traders' Association would be one of the consultees. The contract (handed out to external consultants) will be done before christmas. The consultation (of interest groups, not the public) would happen in spring.

Letters will be very useful to Jim - Jim will not be able to reply to them all.

Neighbourhood Partnerships will be coming in at some point that will deal with
this stuff in the future - these groups will have a budget.